25 replies to this topic

[Berrick]

I'm planning on doing a disciples tournament. I would like your guys opinion and help on a couple thing:

 

1. Should we include Sho in the tournament? We would have to guess at how much he would of improved, what areas he would improved in, what techniques he would of learned, and what his level would be if he stayed alive (Basically it would be a what if version of Sho if he stayed alive and kept improving). If we did I was thinking Sho's ability would increase in line with his talent and inclinations. Essentially since Sho was a speedster glass canon type, I think he would of increased his speed, attack power and his techniques, if he stayed alive. 

 

2. Sho Miu be included in tournament? She like Sho very strong for a disciple class. It might not be fair to the other contestant's to put her in the tournament. 

 

3. Should we include Thor, Kisara, and Loki?

 

4. Should we have preliminary rounds?

 

5. What should the first match up's be? What should be structure of the tournament?

 

6. I'm thinking the one who wins a match should be decided by vote, after we give our own in-depth explanations. What do do you guys think? Should something else decide match? Judges maybe?

Edited by ki0, July 03 2016 - 10:25 AM.

[makenker]

IMO:

 

If you're having a disciple tournament, it would only be fair to include every disciple.
Match-ups should be random
Prelims should be ok

Voting on the winners (with detailed explanations) could work

One-on-One
 

[Berrick]

I was waiting for the others to respond first, to see what they think, but I don't want to wait too long to respond:

 

The reason I'm wary of putting all the disciples in the tournament is because certain disciples are to weak to compete (Ukita I'm looking at you). Kisara doesn't seem that strong either. Also there is the decision needed to be made on which incarnation Sho we would use.

 

Match ups being completely random could cause some problems. Lack of interesting discussion for certain match up's and are complete mismatches (Ukita vs Miu, Kisara vs Sho).   

Edited by ki0, July 05 2016 - 03:20 PM.

[makenker]

Point taken.

So I'm guessing that Ukita, Shiratori, & The Valkyries are out

[Berrick]

Here are the match ups for the first round of the tournament:

 

Bracket A:

 

 

1. Kajima vs Miu

2. Sho vs Renka

3. Rimi vs Lugh

4. Chikage vs Siegfried

 

 

Bracket B:

 

5. Hermit vs Takeda

6. Ryuto vs Berserker

7. Boris vs Tirawat Koukin 

8. Ethan vs Rachel

 

 

Note: Kenichi is seeded, so he will fight the last fighter standing. In Rachel and Ethan's case, they will fight each other as if they aren't siblings. Chikage will fight to at very least to subdue her opponents.  All other fighters will fight with their all (The only exception, in a way, is Kenichi. He's still a slow starter and still will not strike females. This is subject to change depending other poster's views.) 

 

Rules: No holds bar fighting. Killing techniques along with any other technique known are allowed.  

Edited by ki0, July 10 2016 - 12:32 AM.

[Berrick]

Before you vote you should state your opinion on who will win and why, then give others a chance to convince you otherwise (if they believe the other fighter would win). 

[makenker]

IMO
BRACKET A

 

1. Kajima - superior speed (able to react to & avoid Michael's attack), superior skill & dou ki (easily able to beat down Miu despite her having released her dou ki & being in a berserker state), & also the Shinogidachi technique.

 

2. Renka - Renka is on par with Miu, & she has proven herself capable of defeating a Yomi member (Rachel was losing their 2nd fight)

 

3. Rimi - her superior speed, dou ki & 'Roar as One' provide her with a considerable edge

 

4. Chikage - seemingly on par with both Miu & Renka, many Yomi members respect her, & her master is Mikumo (the 5th strongest fighter in the series)

[makenker]

IMO
BRACKET B

 

1. Hermit - accustomed to fighting superior foes, able to take more punishment, & many of his attacks inflict internal damage (hence why he could beat Siegfried)

 

2. Ryuto - he & Berserker appear to be even, but 'Roar as One' gives Ryuto an edge

 

3. Koukin - he beat Kenichi once, Boris couldn't do that

 

4. Rachel - lucha libre's unpredictability, both of her showings against Renka, plus having another style to fall back on gives her an edge

[Berrick]

IMO

 

 

BRACKET A:

 

1. Kajima - with his reactions, ki and power he can overwhelm Miu. One move can potentially end it for Miu. Miu seems to be a glass cannon. If Kajima hits with Shinogidachi she probably loses, if he grabs her leg she probably loses. Miu can possibly win if she avoids Kajima while he over uses Shinogidachi.

 

2. Sho - While Renka is able to follow Sho's movements, she'll have problems with Roar as One (RAO) if she doesn't finish him before he uses it. Also he has one hit kill techniques. If Renka is able to get enough damage on the Sho, who I think is a glass cannon, or hold out during  the duration of RAO then she can probably win.  Another problem is Sho's Gamaku, The only possible ways I can see her getting past that is if she attacks really up close and staying there or attacking from the air. All in all I think she can win, but it's an uphill battle.

 

3. Lugh - I think Lugh would have the advantage, at least initially. Lugh can feel an attack just before it hits him. If he can capitalize on any given opportunity he probably wins, considering the nature of his attacks. The only problem I see for Lugh is Rimi's RAO. If she uses it at the beginning of the fight I see Lugh losing, but she probably won't. She'll probably won't use everything until it's to late. 

 

4. Siegfried - In this battle, it all depends on how Chikage attacks. If she somehow accomplishes simply rushing Siegfried and grabbing him over and over again the he probably loses. Since she uses jujitsu like Akisame she'll probably uses a basic strike to lead with so she can get a throw in thus allow Siegfried to counter. Sieg is completely Go no Sen so he won't attack until she does. In those two aspects I think he has an advantage. 

 

 

 

IMO

 

 

BRACKET B:

 

5. Takeda - I see him having the advantage due to Ryuusei Seikuken, Warp Punch, Auto Rhythm and his released ki. Hermit has a wealth of experience, but I don't think that's enough to beat Takeda. The only way I see him winning is if he was able to get off Kyousa, but I don't see that happening.

 

6. Ryuto -  With these two I think Ryuto has the advantage. Remember when Hermit attacked Berserker up close to stop the variations in Berserker's wind and random attacks? Since Ryuto possesses Seikuken he able to atttack at close range at full speed and he also possesses seeping strength (Fa Jing), he may able to use the same method as Hermit did to gain advantage. At least I thought that, until I pondered on the fact that Berserker also possesses Seikuken, so that method may not work anymore. Berserker can use an even more close range Seikuken then others. What really gives Ryuto the advantage, is that  Berserker won't start out with everything. As the battle prolongs Ryuto gains an advantage, in that his inner eye will allow him to use gungnir with time. As a trump card he has RAO as well. 

 

7. Boris - Boris has many holds and locks and even some strikes that lead into holds. I see Boris having the advantage.

 

8. Ethan - I don't see any of her grapples working against Ethan because of his strength and size he can disable one of her arms with a feint. 

Edited by ki0, July 12 2016 - 06:32 PM.

[Berrick]

bump

[WarBandit]

Kajima vs Miu: I'd say that Kajima would definitely defeat Miu. He seems to just be a good level above her. His Dou kinwas clearly more powerful than hers as well.

Sho vs Renka: Sho would win. Renka, while implied to be somewhere on Miu's level, is lacking in feats because she continuously got reduced to fan service fights. Sho still has some of the best speed feats in the series for a Disciple level fighter and he would probably defeat her with mid difficulty at most.

Rimi vs Lugh: The advantage in speed and power goes to Rimi. But Lugh would easily be able to get inside her head, because really, she isn't the most focused or cerebral fighter. If Lugh gets her any of her leg joints, then she'd be screwed.

Chikage vs Siegfried: Similarly to Renka, there's a lack of feats where Chikage is concerned. However she did totally man handle Kisara. Siegfried might have some issues with her because she's so small, and I think joint locks and grapples would work better against him than strikes. I'm honestly not sure about this fight.

Hermit vs Takeda: I'd definitely give this to Natsu. He's experienced fighting people above his level, and Kyousa would definitely wreck Takeda. Takeda does have good techniques, and did release his Ki, but there's nothing to imply he can do so at will, and his Ryusui Seikuken is very imperfect.

Ryuto vs Berserker: It would depend on how much of his original strength that Ruuro has back and of he can do a prolonged fight. Roar as One only lasts for half a minute. Berserker has already shown he can overpower Kenichi's Seikuken. However I think Ryuto's has always been a bit better since it's a cornerstone of his fighting style. Again, not sure about this fight.

Boris vs Kokin: This is a definite win for Kokin. Boris never pushed Kenichi to near death like Kokin did. Kokin either endured, or nullified every fancy trick Kenichi had. Kokin is a better analyst, physically stronger, and way more durable.

Ethan vs Rachel: I honestly don't think Ethan could bring himself to seriously fight Rachel.

[Berrick]

@WarBandit: 

 

Kajima vs Miu: I agree here, Kajima would likely win.

 

Sho vs Renka: I think Sho would win too, but high difficulty. Renka is probably more experienced then Sho considering that her training consists mostly of real fights. So she probably can deal with most of Sho tactics. Also her inner eye is amazing since she can follow masters attacks, Sho's speed shouldn't be too much of a problem. That said I think Sho has the advantage.

 

Chikage vs Siegfried: I change my mind about this fight, I think Chikage would win. Considering that Siegfried style depends on him straining his muscles and adding the spin motion, I don't think his style would be effective on Chikage, especially considering her height. 

 

Hermit vs Takeda: I'll admit Hermit definitely has a chance to win this fight, but I think Takeda has an advantage as far as technique is concerned. 

 

Ryuto vs Berserker: I think Ryuto has the edge for stated reasons.

 

Boris vs Koukin: I'm of the opposite opinion, I think Boris would win. I see Koukin having a hard time with Boris combination attacks, that lead into grapples.  

 

Ethan vs Rachel: In this match they act like they aren't related or they just spar. I think Ethan would win because of his flexibility and strength, none of her wrestling moves would probably be effective.

[Berrick]

Next Monday the tournament is going to the next round, so if you want to comment on the first do it before then. 

[Berrick]

2nd round goes as follows:

 

 

Kajima vs Sho

 

Lugh vs Chikage

 

Hermit vs Ryuto

 

Koukin vs Rachel

[WarBandit]

Sho is probably faster than Kajima, and I think he will do far better at dodging the Shinogidachi, which will hurt Kajima more in the end. However Kajima can release his Ki, which is a good secondary advantage and more sustainable and safe than Roar as One. I'd give it to Kajima, just because he has far better durability feats.

Based on hype, I think Chikage is both stronger and has better potential. But I simply don't think she has enough on panel feats to debate with.

It would depend on if Ryuto's body is at its best. Regardless, a Kyousa would likely mess Ryuto up, bad. I'd lean to Natsu because he's been training more extensively against people above his level and Ryuto might have fallen slightly behind him, I think.

Kokin definitely defeats Rachel, serious or showing off. Her fighting style and persona would be more than easy enough for him to analyse and she doesn't have the strength/techniques to put him down or the durability to endure his attacks. Kokin is probably the fullest package in Yomi in terms of strength intelligence, durability, skill, etc with no real exploitable "weakness."

[Berrick]

Kajima...Kajima has the reaction speed to keep up with Sho, has more durability, and his attack power is great as well. Also he has Shinogidachi, which gives him amazing offense and defense.

 

Chikage... I believe that as soon as they touch she will throw him. Also he to tall to really get her with most of his moves.

 

Ryuto...Ryuto knows about Kyousa so I doubt he would let Hermit hit him with it, especially with his Seilkuken. Speaking of Seikuken, Hermit would have a hard time getting past Ryuto's. Hermit would have to end Ryuto quickly to win and I don't think he would be able to do that. Ryuto has the option of ending the fight quickly with quick spurts of SeiDou Goui or ending later with Gungnir which he apparently improved (he used very quickly against Sho's bodyguards). 

 

Koukin... I would say Koukin has the advantage. IMO he would have more moderate to high difficulty win against her. How hard it is for her to lose depends on the setting. If no one is around then she'll fight seriously. She's strong as she was able to compete with Renka. She has impressive defense, with her Choukei technique. The problem is I think Kyoukin is a good deal stronger than her. I forgot exactly his strength feats, but I remember they seemed impressive in my eyes. So even if she gets a hold on him, he can just push through it. 

[Berrick]

Should I kick Kajima out of the tournament and redo the matches that had him in it, but with Jihan? I was thinking that any match with Kajima in it he's going to win except one the last one with Kenichi. That makes it slightly boring.

 

 So maybe we could redo some of the matches in bracket A. What do you guys think?

[WarBandit]

We never saw the extent of Jihan's strength.

I agree with Akisame when he said Jihan was at a territory disadvantage. There's no way his body wasn't numb as hell, wearing silks and no shoes or coat in the middle of a snowstorm when he's from a tropical country. The fact that he was even able to temporarily overwhelm Kenichi is impressive. He couldn't have been blat his best during that fight. Not that I think he'd have won, but it would have been a longer fight in a different, neutral location.

[Berrick]

Yeah, Jihan never used his full strength. According to him he had 18 styles and only used 3 on Kenichi. Also he was a bit too arrogant, that hinder his results. Jihan did go up against Sho Kano once in a skirmish and did pretty well at the beginning. 

[WarBandit]

It's really too bad because in would have liked to see a good fight with a pencak silat disciple. I never even heard of the style before HSDK and I found it to be intriguing.